The World's Greatest Rug ID Thread.

[Greenie]

eeew! that is a lot of skin and turds.

 

[rhyde]

The only other way is to spend a quarter million dollars on a Moore machine if you can find one.

a moore machine won't get all that out

 

[Ken Snow]

Running the rug through a Moore upside down and then right side up or visa versa would gt the majority out esp if run through an automated beater first.

 

[XTREME1]

I almost bought a moore roll for $75,000-90,000. Wish I had

 

[Jim Morrison]

I really enjoy rugs, don't see very many nice ones so I always like the photos.
Here is one,

Any comments?

 

[-JB-]

yes it's perdy.

 

[esquireservicesinc]

Anyone know where I can get one of these air guns?

X2....

 

[Guest]

Re: The World's Greatest Rug ID Thread. Do you need ID to clean?

Thought I'd chime in on this since we are aiming for the world's greatest ... though I might end up making it the world's worst now.

You do NOT need to know where a rug is from, it's village, it's age, to clean it. A 1920 Sarouk and a 1980 Karastan machine made wool will be cleaned the same.

This was my biggest gripe 6+ years ago when the Rug Lady had an article rug quiz and said that if you could not ID a dhurrie from a Karastan, then you should not clean those rugs.

Spoken like a real "teacher" to cleaners trying to sell more certification courses ... rather than a practical cleaner trying to help keep people out of trouble.

To clean a rug you need to know:
fiber type
dye stability
construction concerns
pre-inspection skills

An attentive and knowledgeable cleaner will be able to wash any rug well if he has all these areas covered. In fact, with the right cleaning know-how (usually all coming from experience and not necessarily a book or quiz) someone with low-tech tools can clean as well, if not much better than, fancier high-tech options. It's just like in the home cleaning ... whether you are talking truckmount, portable, or other options - it's more the Tech than it is the Tool that determines the outcome.

What Rug ID is great for however is MARKETING and TRUST with clients. If you come in and can tell a client where their rug is from, you can build immediate credibility.

I've been around rugs most of my life ... and my mother is a weaver. Today many rugs look alike, but she can look at the twists of fibers, and the feel of the construction, and can identify things that I've rarely seen anyone else do - all from pulling apart and putting back together so many different rugs over decades and decades. You just can't teach that. Ken's right ... after a month of being around so many rugs, you just instinctively know things and don't know how to explain it.

I'm still learning .. even though I try to teach this stuff, at least what I know. It's constant learning. Anyone who says they know it all on rugs, is simply a liar. Even my mom doesn't know everything.

So ... test the dyes with hot water, on the back side ... and test it with your solution if it is alkaline ... and if no transfer occurs, you are safe to clean. I have a pre-inspection checklist if anyone would like to have a copy. Just email me at lisa@joepolish.com and put "rug checklist" in the subject line. Even though I'm at Piranha full-time now ... I still stay connected to the rug info. gotta keep connected to your first love.

Take care,
Lisa Wagner

Thank you Lisa for the input. Right now I just want to care about cleaning a rug properly and identify which rugs I potentially could damage, and which ones I can can clean without the "fear". When I am making a lot of money and can afford to go to Necker Island, then I will be interested in which tribe, which region, and family history of them all. Until that date, I appreciate input on how to identify the rugs by a set "checklist" or standard to clean by.

 

[rhyde]

Here is one,

Any comments?

Nepal

 

[Jim Morrison]

Nepal

Is that code for something deeper?

 

[rhyde]

made in nepal by tibetans and yeah it's secret code :roll:

 

[Jim Morrison]

lol, good thing that map had North marked on it, I was starting to get confused.

Thanks Randy, I was just wondering if anyone had comments on it. I bought it a couple of months ago. Funny thing I wasn't even shopping for a rug, I was buying a Sigg water bottle from a guy selling bottles in his rug cleaning plant store front. As soon as I saw it I knew I would buy it (impulsive or what?).

It's a Pumori, I think the wool in it is from New Zealand. Seems to me the salesman said the more vibrant colored wools were from New Zealand. They had a replica of the loom it was made on, some kind of a gizmo with a rod that the strands are tied around, then the strands are cut in half after the rod is full.

The designer is from Hawaii and he won't let them post pictures of his rugs on their website, he's concerned someone will use his artwork.

 

[rhyde]

People rip off rug designs all the time sometimes before they even get to market.

in fact this one is kind of a rip off from an older Odeguard Tibetan rug which is a rip-off of old Tibetan tiger stripe rugs. It’s an alright rug the wool is most likely domestic from Nepal. Why would the colors be more vibrant from New Zealand can’t Nepalese dye vibrant colors?

 

[Ken Snow]

Randy has it exactly right on all poijnts!

 

[harryhides]

Do they make any rugs in Bhutan right next door to Tibet and Nepal.
Just curious as I've never seen any.

Ps, Here is another way to "dust rugs". This is the way it was done in Nebraska around 1900.

 

[roro]

Why would the colors be more vibrant from New Zealand can’t Nepalese dye vibrant colors?

Perhaps because the wool is scoured to a higher standard than the local product with which it is mixed.As with Indian rugs the finer NZ wool is blended with the local product which is coarser.
It would seem to make sense to me that the dye takeup would be better on the wool that had the most lanolin and dirt removed.

roro

 

[rhyde]

I don’t know of any Tibetan rug companies that blend their wools not that there aren’t any ..at least the major ones I work with use 100% Tibetan highland sheep wool for their rugs and I have no idea which is coarser processig could be the anser?


A dusting wheel works well but there are plenty of rugs you’ll rip to shreds in that thing so it has fairly limited use any rug with repair needs, most thick rugs, dry rot, mildew, worn rugs


I believe there are some rugs made in Bhutan but Bhutan and Nepal are new to rug making Nepal had not rug weaving prior to the 1960’s it was the result of Tibetan refugees

 

[The Great Oz]

Not all rugs can be tumbled, but flexing the nap open is a great way to remove embedded soil. The size Tony shows does allow for quite a drop. We have a (much smaller) tumbler to use for rugs that are packed with sand. It also does a great job of removing pile shading from Chinese hand-knotted rugs.

 

[Bob Foster]

.

 

[roro]

I don’t know of any Tibetan rug companies that blend their wools not that there aren’t any ..at least the major ones I work with use 100% Tibetan highland sheep wool for their rugs and I have no idea which is coarser processig could be the anser?

Extract from AgResearch

"The major export markets and their main end uses for NZ wool in 2006/07 were: China & Hong Kong (27%) – hand-knitting yarn, carpets; United Kingdom (15%) -
carpets; India (11%) – hand-made carpets; Australia (4%), Belgium (6%), Germany (4%) – carpets; Italy (8%) – apparel; USA, Japan, Nepal (all around 4 %).
The main uses for NZ wool (by approx. amount) are: machine-made carpets (34%), hand-made carpets (12%)..."

A friend of mine was the manager of a wool scour and had occasion to visit Nepal at least twice when there was a processing problem.
Similarly when I was selling rugs about 20 years ago Nepalese rugs were invariably blended, as were the Indian "Aubussons"


roro

roro

 

[rhyde]

Tufenkian for example uses 100% Himalayan wool truth is I don’t know if or how many blend but the ones i'm familiar with don’t. Nepal makes plenty of hand crafts scarf’s, shawls where Himalayan wool is not as desirable your link seems to confirm this the 4% quoted is for apparel... yes?

“apparel; USA, Japan, Nepal (all around 4 %).”

 

[DUSTY]

Wow, what a fantastic thread. Thanks for inviting me over Mikey.

We are now doing pre-inspections with a flip,, what a fantastic tool to record the rug, make notes about all stains, damage etc on the rug, upsell the client even when they are not in your presences (i just send them the file or youtube it) and then video the results.

Here is a quick and dirty pre-inspection.. btw this one was owned by a client that winters in Pheonix and summers here so she was not around. When she saw this video she had us do all her rugs with an invoice over 1600..not bad for a $100 investment in a cam.

g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILeElogEpEIg]

 

[-JB-]

So D, what do you do to prevent an infestation in your shop in this case?

Also, what advice do you offer Mrs. Pilfington on ridding her home of the lil buggers?

 

[DUSTY]

First we freeze the rugs then we nuke em with Masterblends Repel.

We also hooked her up with someone that would sweep and vac the whole home including the upholstered furniture.


Anytime we see a rug with moth damage even if it is old we will treat the rug for moth as we never want cross contamination, and the rugs will go directly into plastic and into the deep freeze. We will then advise the client that every wool rug in the home should be treated for moth and all other rugs should be cleaned as they may have some eggs in them. We also advise the client to have all wool garments cleaned at the same time, then we give them advise on how to avoid moth re-infestation.

 

[DUSTY]

Dusty's Flip cam

Ok, I've had a few folk asking me what cam I am using,, I have tried a few and broke a couple as well.

This one is the best IMHO.

http://us.creative.com/products/product ... 7761&nav=1

Its about $70 only and if you order with a spare battery the shipping is free!

 

[DUSTY]

Moths-by Dusty

Moth larvae eat the wool only. They are commonly called the clothing moth.


My service manager Mary did a nice blog on moths. Take a look and say hi if you enjoy the blog.

http://ruglovermary.blogspot.com/search?q=moth


for more on moths you can check out Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tineola_bisselliella

 

[DUSTY]

Oh yeah,,another interesting bit of trivia.. Moths prefer dirty wool. If a rug has been contaminated with urine the moth will lay their eggs in the stained area.. Of coarse this is a good thing to communicate to potential clients to encourage them to have their rugs cleaned more often.

From Wikipedia:
The Clothing Moth (Tineola bisselliella) and the Case-bearing Clothes Moth (Tinea pellionella) are notorious for feeding on clothing and natural fibres; they have the ability to turn keratin, a protein present in hair and wool, into food. Clothing moths prefer dirty fabric and are particularly attracted to carpeting and clothing that contain human sweat or other liquids which have been spilled onto them. They are attracted to these areas not for the food but for the moisture. Moth larvae do not drink water; consequently their food must contain moisture.

 

[The Great Oz]

Do moths typically feed off of just wool. or do they eat other natural fabrics like cotton and silk as well ?

They eat any protien-based material, including dead skin, leather, even nail clippings. I've seen a dead mouse that had no hair or skin over the skull and had moth casings all around it, and trophy heads and pelts that have been damaged by moths. I haven't seen any leather damage to finished leather products, so I believe that tanning process must make the leather an unattractive food. I've also seen moth infestations in homes that had no wool. The moths were living on the layer of shed skin on the carpet below the headboard of the bed.

Beetles are more likely to eat protiens other than wool though, and the most likely to eat silk.

Silverfish are attracted to food starch and will eat cellulose in books and newspapers, with rayon and jute thrown in. They may damage fabric as a side effect of getting at the starch in either starched clothing or polished cotton created by using a food starch.

 

[DUSTY]

I have never seen a silk rug damaged by moths. I believe you Bryon, but sure would love to see a pic of a damaged silk rug.

 

[The Great Oz]

I think they are more likely to go after soiled silk fabric, and I've seen lots of insect damaged fabric. I have seen some silk rugs with pock marks of damage that could have been caused by insects but I've never taken the time to put one under the microscope.

I'll take a closer look the next time one comes in with apparent insect damage.