Just getting started and it's going too well. Lots of questions.

[A.J.]

WALL OF TEXT. Drop to questions if you don't care to hear my story.

I do drywall finishing by day and office cleaning at night (odd combo huh?) for the last 10 years.
My little brother had a couple years part time experience working for a HACK with an old Bane clene POS that could make water more than warm. Then bought an old Platinum 2001. He failed at his own business because he's not capable of being his own boss.

So I bought the machine. Really high heat (hit 280 on accident), pressure and tons of vacuum. But it's old and will have lots of problems soon i'm sure (Like having to go buy a fuel pressure regulator on the first job because it was being flooded). Also it can't run a rinse, i'm stuck with just water. But hey $1200 for a machine, water tank, and a couple a 100ft of hoses and other small tools I thought I could make some money with it. So I bought a van to side it in too.

I thought my brother knew all about carpet cleaning and he could teach me. WRONG. He's a fantastic salesman that's great at quoting what the chemical bottles say lol. After watching probably every youtube vid I can find and reading on here for a week I hate to say I know more than him now.

Big work is lining up and I'm not even under bidding ( I just stay cheaper than Stanley Steamer) or advertising yet. Just talking to people I know. I dont even have my logo or cards finalized. My brother is lining up work just from cold calls and old connections. I'd say charm is any entrepreneur's greatest tool.

I just today picked up a client today that has 80 houses and 250 apartment/duplexes and I'm freaking out a bit. They didn't even care about prices....

QUESTIONS
I need a middle of the pack upholstery tool for stairs and furniture. Suggestions? I'm not buying a stair tool. If I can handle drywall I can bend down for cleaning.

I'm going to need a new side in ASAP I guess. Currently I'm thinking a Judson c4. I've read every good and bad thing about him on here. I wanta SIMPLE, dual wand and powerful. Any other thoughts for a side in?

I currently just have this cheesy wand. A GlideMaster s bend 2jet. Does that (amongst other things) make me a hack right there? If so what's a decent wand?

I loaded up on chemicals from Advantage Marketing. Anybody have an opinion for their stuff?

Dumb question I haven't fully found the answer on. Do I just add deodorizer to my pre spray or do I put it on after like scotch guard? If so, before or after scotch guard?

If I'm doing commercial carpet do I only use lane cleaner for the whole thing or just normal pre spray with some degreaser mixed in it?

THANK YOU! I hope to make this place my new home.

 

[Mikey P]

Welcome aboard!

QUESTIONS
I need a middle of the pack upholstery tool for stairs and furniture. Suggestions? I'm not buying a stair tool. If I can handle drywall I can bend down for cleaning. Start with the PMF internal tool. Does most everything.

I'm going to need a new side in ASAP I guess. Currently I'm thinking a Judson c4. I've read every good and bad thing about him on here. I wanta SIMPLE, dual wand and powerful. Any other thoughts for a side in?
Simple would be the C4, even simpler would be the Cobb version. Propane sucks IMO.

I currently just have this cheesy wand. A GlideMaster s bend 2jet. Does that (amongst other things) make me a hack right there? If so what's a decent wand? Some guys here love that wand, also know as the AW29. Do yourself and your clients a fave and use a 2" tubed wand 2 or 4 jet and no whip hose. Prochem has nice one (made by PMF, as does Westpack)

I loaded up on chemicals from Advantage Marketing. Anybody have an opinion for their stuff? Nope My presprays of choice are Flex for nasties, Redline for moderate and Chemspec One Earth TLC for dedicates.

Dumb question I haven't fully found the answer on. Do I just add deodorizer to my pre spray or do I put it on after like scotch guard? If so, before or after scotch guard? For pet odors apply before and IN your prespray.

If I'm doing commercial carpet do I only use lane cleaner for the whole thing or just normal pre spray with some degreaser mixed in it? Too much hassle to switch for different soiling conditions but you could.. We just add the degreaser booster to the prespray and hit


Don't forget to get a 175 wiht a shampoo brush and some fiber pads and bonnets everything.


make some money then get a rotary extractor.

 

[Captain America]

Aj sounds like you are a hard worker and have what it takes to have a carpet cleaning business.
Judson guys have been one of the first to build truckmounts and probably have enough experience and info.
To get you started. They have been around 40 years??
Those bane clean machines are at the bottom of the truckmounts.
Larger engines + larger blowers = more vacuum
Propane and kerosene are the highest heat.....
The 35 hp judson looks good...give him a call and keep researching...
Happy cleaning
Cap

 

[hogjowl]

Cheaper than Stanley Steemer?

 

[A.J.]

Hmm I can't figure out how to edit a post on my phone. I find what I thought I put down and what I see after I click "post" are different things All to often.
I meant to say the bane clene could hardly make warm water. And so don't seem like I'm tooting my own horn, my little bro is the one with all the charm, not me. The kid can sell.

One more question. Do you charge more or less for Comercial? I have no idea what peope charge around here on Comercial

 

[A.J.]

Cheaper than Stanley Steemer?

To come to our county for a 2 bed apartment your lookING at $45 a room, $25 a room for Scotch guard, 25 a room for deodorizer. $285 is insane in my opinion.

 

[FredC]

how much should it cost?

 

[A.J.]

how much should it cost?

Dang maybe my ideas on pricing are off?
Well there are guys the county over that are top rated on google that advertise at $69 for 3 rooms then $12 a room for deodorizer/Scotchguard.
I won't go that cheap. So I figured I'd sit right in between them and Stanley. I don't see how I'd get any work as high as Stanley (since I dont have their big name) when guys that aren't complete hacks are going that cheap.

 

[hogjowl]

Start keeping detailed notes NOW so you can intelligently determine what your pricing actually should be.
Track:
Room sizes and s.f. on every job.
How long you spend on each job.
Of course, what you charged.
These figures will tell you your gross per hour and by s.f. You will also know your hours worked weekly , monthly and yearly.

Keep track of all of your expenses, of course. Not just for tax purposes, but also for pricing. ALL your expenses, including what you pay yourself.

Every month, determine the total hours worked and s.f cleaned. Also calculate the gross revenue per hour and by the s.f. Then take your total expenses and calculate the expenses by hour and sf.

Determine your profit or loss by hour worked and sf cleaned.

Adjust accordingly.

 

[A.J.]

don't help yourself or o

Welcome to the Board.
Pricing- You can't set your price on what your competitors charge. you need to know your cost.

$285 is not outrageous at all. Don't be the new hack who goes on the cheap, you don't help yourself or our industry.

Don't set yourself up against SS big mistake in our market.

I know you need the work as you are starting. Don't get too excited about those 280 homes and apartments.
3 major companies have driven the price down in Indy for the worse. $55 for 3 beds and then you use menu to charge a decent price is not the way to go IMHO. Complexes have been conditioned all the time to low price. The out of state owners demand these low rates from service providers and then are steamed when you do not meet their demands.

We get calls every month from complexes wanting a new cleaner. They always tell me one of 3 companies. They hate them. As a courtesy I go bid. I give them our pricing and how we do business. They always go back to the old companies. You can't want better service and quality and not expect to pay more. Complexes in indy have yet to figure that out.

You are in a college town and the market is really messed up in central indianapolis for apartments and rentals.

If you focus on those you may get trapped as a low end cleaner be careful.
you have 2 fine cleaning and restoration companies in Bloominton. Learn from them.

We have never done apartments or tons of rentals and have done fine.
There are several on this board who do very well in college towns. It is a demanding part of our industry. If you do not manage it well it could hurt you.

I started with a POS Bane a few years ago don't knock it till you try it. We run 4.8CDS units today.

PS take a class from Advantage. They have their juice produced from a small manufacture in park 100. Their reps have been in my office several times.

Heat is not the most important thing a TM does.

Do you know the four principles of Cleaning? TACT
Do you know the 5 must do steps for cleaning?

The great cleaners here will help. I am the hack on this board for that.

Listen to the pros not distributors on the right juice to use. They are in the cleaners part of the forum. do a search before you ask this has been covered well in past posts.

Thanks for the advice!

$285 just seems nuts since I once had carpet purchased and installed in 3 beds for only $200 more. Granted it was cheap stuff.

There is money to made in all these collage apartments but I'm not sure how yet. Even at only $50 a pop when they line up 50 in a row and don't care how hard you work on spots, there's a good $40 per hr profit to be made. I have a friend that does it and he mostly does high end work and zero advertising and says he makes half his years salary in Aug when they all turn over. Do you know Indiana Pro clean? I met that guy when he was first starting about 7 years ago. He now has 5 or 6 vans and a few trucks and a big office here in town. He was all about commercial work and apartments, I could tell he was going to make it big. That showed me theres room for grow here.

I do know TACT! However I don't the 5 must do steps.

Once I'm confidant in my abilities I do plan on going for mostly high end work. I know a lot of doctor lawyer types that will pay whatever you if they like/trust you.

Other than Bane, is there anyone in out area that sells TMs?

 

[Shane Deubell]

I would add a couple more "costs"when it comes to pricing.

1. We need to replace van/equipment on a regular basis 7 years or whatever
so depending on which set up thats $500 month

2. We need emergency funds - $300 month at least
Its amazing how often you will find yourself saying " of all times for this to happen..."

3. When you were an employee you had all these invisible benefits that YOU now have to self fund.
Unemployment
Disability
Workers comp
Vacations
Medical
Retirement

Thats another $2k month

I know, I know you will worry about that stuff later....

 

[hogjowl]

"$40 per hour "

 

[Desk Jockey]

Quit now while you're ahead and save yourself a lot of grief.

You are only going to get in deeper and if you're not committed to carpet cleaning you'll eventually give up on it anyway. If you already have a drywall business then keep that skill set busy. Take the time, effort and money you would invest in carpet cleaning and build the business you know.

 

[A.J.]

I would add a couple more "costs"when it comes to pricing.

1. We need to replace van/equipment on a regular basis 7 years or whatever
so depending on which set up thats $500 month

2. We need emergency funds - $300 month at least
Its amazing how often you will find yourself saying " of all times for this to happen..."

3. When you were an employee you had all these invisible benefits that YOU now have to self fund.
Unemployment
Disability
Workers comp
Vacations
Medical
Retirement

Thats another $2k month

I know, I know you will worry about that stuff later....

Well I've been self employed for 13 years so I've never had them benefits.

 

[A.J.]

Quit now while you're ahead and save yourself a lot of grief.

You are only going to get in deeper and if you're not committed to carpet cleaning you'll eventually give up on it anyway. If you already have a drywall business then keep that skill set busy. Take the time, effort and money you would invest in carpet cleaning and build the business you know.

Thank you for a new background on my PC lol.

After buying a van cash I'm no longer ahead. I'm all in at this point, quitting or failing isn't an option.

Although successful at drywall I hate every day of. Always preferred cleaning offices at night.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Although successful at drywall I hate every day of. Always preferred cleaning offices at night.

Entrepreneurial drift?

If you're not happy that is a tough way to make a living. Cleaning can make you a good living but aside from your cleaning skills you need to market well to bring in the work. Good luck!

 

[Shane Deubell]

Well I've been self employed for 13 years so I've never had them benefits.

Start !

These are part of your fixed monthly costs.
This is exactly why most contractors in any industry fail.

Long term planning worked into your costs.

When you buy a rental property, you have to figure out long term expenses like roof, foundation, furnace, on top of the yearly maintenance.
This is all worked into your monthly rent and should be saved in a separate account.

Any guy can figure out how much prespray or gas costs every month, what is your fixed replacement cost, advertising, retirement, disability.

Otherwise you will spend your life always looking for the next best thing...

 

[Steve Toburen]

Just by finding this little rough-and-tumble "band of brothers", AJ, you are already ahead of 99% of the start-up cleaners out there. You have received a lot of great advice above. Plus I think you will do great because you obviously bring out the best in people. For example...

Start keeping detailed notes NOW so you can intelligently determine what your pricing actually should be.
Track:
Room sizes and s.f. on every job.
How long you spend on each job.
Of course, what you charged.
These figures will tell you your gross per hour and by s.f. You will also know your hours worked weekly , monthly and yearly.

Keep track of all of your expenses, of course. Not just for tax purposes, but also for pricing. ALL your expenses, including what you pay yourself.

Every month, determine the total hours worked and s.f cleaned. Also calculate the gross revenue per hour and by the s.f. Then take your total expenses and calculate the expenses by hour and sf.

Determine your profit or loss by hour worked and sf cleaned.

Adjust accordingly.

AJ, this is one of the few (and I do mean VERY FEW) non-snarky, highly analytical and genuinely helpful posts I have seen out of the 13,270 plus Mr. Sutley has submitted here. So we all hope you decide to stick around. If you want a pre-done, easy to use Production/Pricing Analysis Form to do what Marty is suggesting get it for free HERE. (You don't have to register for anything.)

Best wishes,
Steve

PS AJ, Bill Yeadon and I are teaching our first 3 day Steps to Success (STS) seminar that gets new carpet cleaners "started off right" March 30-April 1st at Jon-Don's Chicago headquarters. It sounds like something that might be exactly what you need. In three days STS crams in everything from hands-on cleaning instruction to how to get your phone ringing QUICKLY! (And how to answer it when it does ring!) Read more about the STS seminar HERE.

 

[hogjowl]

You need to do some more research before you go any farther your impression of pricing is way off.

I do not know Indiana Pro Clean. I did look at his web site. Looks clean and well organized.

He looks to be about 5 carpet trucks from his Facebook page. He also does Jan San. That is a lot of work at lower margins

I wouldn't call that made it big. I know lots of guy who run 1 - 1.5 trucks and make a lot more personally than us 4-5 truckers.

You should find a mentor out of the area for university town cleaning. I think you might be off on your expectations of profit. Just wait till you drop a tranny and then a blower goes. Your $40 will be chump change.

You never want to build a business where more than 10% comes from one client or 25% from one market segment.

Someone who is making most of their money in a short season in this business could get in trouble very quickly if something changes in the market.

If you want good truck mounts call jondon in Roselle IL. If you are very mechanical look at butler units lots of top guys here run them. If you got big a kahonas get a big box truck like the big boys on here.

I think Tom meant to say if you AREN'T very mechanical look at a Butler.

But not at $40 per hour.

 

[Mike Draper]

My opinion as I'm guessing is the opinion of most long term and half way successful cleaners on here is that you need to NET a minimum of $100. per hour if you ever want to make a half decent living. A net of $40. per hour will most certainly turn into a loss at the end of the year, especially your first few years.

 

[hogjowl]

My $100 per hour has actually gone up to $150per hour. Not because I'm trying to be a bulletin board guru, but simply because that's what I HAVE to have to eat and pay my bills.

It's not 1995 anymore.

 

[Dolly Llama]

you rarely see me post in this room...because I'm a pi$$ poor bizman and don't belong here

but I'll share something with you....i started 25 years ago in the same trap you're thinking about getting into.
$50-$60-$75 dollar apts
You're not going to make what you think.
Those 50 lined up "like ducks in a row" in the student rentals won't go so smooth...painters and contractors will be in your way...they all won't be ready like they "promised"

Doors supposed to unlocked WON'T be
Carpets will be trashed.

It took me 8-10 years to get out of the "apt trap"........."need" the work, fear of losing the account if i raised prices was the "trap"

we do a 1/4 of the apts we used to do, cause 3/4s of them won't pay what they're worth...cause there's always some "hungry new guy" like YOU (and me when i started) willing to do great work for cheap

you mentioned you hate drywall finishing (me too, i sub out the lg jobs)
But do you hate painting too?
Seems you'd have all the right contacts in place ....and start up costs are down right cheap compared to TMs and tools /gear


not that that would matter, cause I'm "guessing" you'd likely fall into the same trap there ...thinking you could make money painting 2 bd rm apts for $two-fiddy a pop


..L.T.A.

 

[Mike Draper]

I'll second Larry. I do approximately 50% commcercial and 50% residential. I live in a college town and do a ton of apartments when college gets out in may and again in August before move in. Doors are locked, shit is everywhere, painters, plumbers, house cleaning and anything else in between is in my way. Carpets are always trashed. It took me 5 years to get my foot in the door at a reasonable price to clean many of these places. Work wont come overnight or even after your first year. IMO it takes years of hard work and quality results before others will start to know your reputation and want to hire you because they are sick of hacks. Even then, many places dont care about quality work, just a cheap price. Being a more expensive high end cleaner takes a variety of qulaity tools and I believe years of knowledge and practice to know how to best clean the toughest jobs and get results better than your competition. I dont consider my self a "high end" cleaner as most of my clients are middle class. I just push for higher quality cleaning superior to my competition. Remember, nothing worthwhile in life comes easy.

 

[Captain America]

I would say deverisify. Apts. rentals homes returants even til and grout....
When I started I did apts. rentals and returants ...I still do returants and rentals.
Adv. of these apts rentals is you stay busy, continual work, they are not as picky and you are on your own if you make a mistake or 2.
If you get your system down you should make around 50$ hour on apts, and then work your way. Out of itin a few years if you want. One apt. Complex I did had 6 month cleaning for customers, they told me to clean whatever carpet was available in the apt. Some of those apts didn't have 10 -15 ft of carpet- took me about 10 minutes to clean it, so everything has it's advantage. We used to time ourselves and I believe our record was about 7 minutes- so have fun cleaning it's a great career.

 

[hogjowl]

Sorry Tom. I have no experience with Butlers. I'm just going by all the posts I've read over the years where guys talk about how simple and reliable they are.

 

[Steve Toburen]

AJ, this is one of the few (and I do mean VERY FEW) non-snarky, highly analytical and genuinely helpful posts I have seen out of the 13,270 plus Mr. Sutley has submitted here. So we all hope you decide to stick around...

Wow. First Marty ignores my genuinely trying-to-be-hurtful post. Then he actually puts the word "sorry" in his post above. So who is posting under Marty's log-in?

Steve

PS AJ, you are cutting years off your growth curve with the advice in the posts above. Plusthis free website section HERE is designed for newbys.

 

[hogjowl]

The truth doesn't hurt me, Island Boy.

 

[bob vawter]

i love being retired...
and letting you saps
support me!

 

[GCCLee]

Sounds like you have the elements in place..... Get to know your products and learn some techniques by hanging around here and soon you will be on your way to a Multi Truck Operation...


Time is Money, and Remember Not to Sell Your Steak For a Cheeze Burger Price : )

 

[Spurlington]

Maybe before you get too far, instead of a new machine, you shudd mount an 18/20HP Kohler to run a 36/45 blower to your Bene System. Add a Little Giant heater to boost your already warm water.

Be a good starter and won't be too much of a loss if you've decided this wasn't what you had in mind.