Here is one for the books... unglazed porcelain fail

[Jim Pemberton]

I see it as a character asset

Then you might appreciate this story (its long, but you should appreciate the ending):

For years, one of the major fiber producers had a representative who attended all the major functions. No matter how publicly I took his organization apart, he would always come to me, shake my hand while holding his other one over it too, smile and tell me how much he and his company appreciated everything my father and I did for the industry. It was always the exact same line, to the point I could say every word in advance.

I resented it each time he did it, because I knew he couldn't possibly mean it.

After some years, he left that position and became a consultant for a flooring group of some sort. The first time I saw him after that, he looked me with all the hostility and contempt I richly deserved for all those years of criticism from me, and wouldn't speak to me at all.

At that point, I found a new respect for him that I never had before!

 

[hogjowl]

You’ve clearly not reached my level if he was able to hide his contempt for any length of time.

 

[roro]

You actually were somewhat pissy back then

Now prissy I could agree with, but "pissy" reminds me of the grubby character flaw which 48.2% of male denizens of the USA have, and that is not something I see Gentleman Jim subscribing to.

 

[hogjowl]

ST U

 

[The carpet cleaning professor]

So this is what it looks like when people try to repair it with coatings This appears to be an older floor at that?
This is just crazyness

 

[The Great Oz]

For Fred's sake, Porcelain is less absorbent than earthenware but will still stain unless vitrified. That process creates the impervious glass-like product with which we're most familiar.

No vitrification? Porcelain stains.

Polished porcelain takes the glaze-like surface off, so makes vitrified porcelain into no-vit. "Polished" is likely the product giving tile cleaners fits, as it has to be sealed to stop staining. In many cases "polish" should be called "honed" since they're doing it to create a dull finish.


Kind of funny that the trend is toward shiny rug fiber and away from shiny stone and tile surfaces; in both cases the product is worse.

 

[Mikey P]

Polished porcelain takes the glaze-like surface off, so makes vitrified porcelain into no-vit. "Polished" is likely the product giving tile cleaners fits, as it has to be sealed to stop staining. In many cases "polish" should be called "honed" since they're doing it to create a dull finish.

This the water staining or whatever you want to call it is showing up on all types of porcelain, it's just far more visible on the matte finish variety that has the very realistic photograph of either wood or stone.

 

[FredC]

Polished porcelain takes the glaze-like surface off, so makes vitrified porcelain into no-vit. "Polished" is likely the product giving tile cleaners fits, as it has to be sealed to stop staining. In many cases "polish" should be called "honed" since they're doing it to create a dull finish.

Yes.

and coatings are often added on polished/honed. Which is likely what is being removed. I think the staining we are seeing in this example is a consequence of the incomplete removal given the "pattern" . An epoxy grout haze remover is more likely to remove the coating with longer dwell.

Then a penetrating sealer/porcelain specific can go back....assuming some other process wasn't used for the matte finish






I thought about going and picking some up to play with........but seems a dumb thing for me to spend money on

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Anatolia-Tile-Carbon-Matte-12-in-x-12-in-Unglazed-Porcelain-Hexagon-Mosaic-Wall-Tile/1001048600#preview-specifications

 

[Mikey P]

An epoxy grout haze remover is more likely to remove the coating with longer dwell.

You seem to be hung up on the epoxy grout haze remover and in this case none was used, I posted a picture sent to me by the homeowner of what she used

 

[FredC]

You seem to be hung up on the epoxy grout haze remover and in this case none was used, I posted a picture sent to me by the homeowner of what she used

I guess I'm just not explaining it right.

Whether or not epoxy grout remover was used there seems to be something that removed or damaged a topical finish. I mentioned the epoxy haze remover because given enough dwell it is the most likely to do so out of what I thought might have been used by the home owner. There was also a chance, with only pictures to go by, that given the grout color and small tile that what might appear to be a coating wasn't one at all.


The haze remover could be used to strip the remainder

 

[Mikey P]

I guess I'm just not explaining it right.

Whether or not epoxy grout remover was used there seems to be something that removed or damaged a topical finish. I mentioned the epoxy haze remover because given enough dwell it is the most likely to do so out of what I thought might have been used by the home owner. There was also a chance, with only pictures to go by, that given the grout color and small tile that what might appear to be a coating wasn't one at all.


The haze remover could be used to strip the remainder

Which is exactly what she is doing, but now the tile is so absorbent that plain water is staining it..

You do know that most of America cleans their showers with acidic cleaners, right Fred?

 

[FredC]

Which is exactly what she is doing, but now the tile is so absorbent that plain water is staining it..

You do know that most of America cleans their showers with acidic cleaners, right Fred?

Yes.

Maybe next time you call I'll explain...but I'll try once more.

Unglazed porcelain tile would be fine in a wet are because it has little porosity.
Any increase in that porosity would be caused by methods to create a particular appearance (matte/polished)(Bryan's post)
When this is done sometimes a protective layer is added during manufacturing.

One wouldn't expect the protective layer to be lifted by a product that the manufacturer actually recommends and is commonly used to remove the grout haze after installation.

So if it is* the coating being removed it is a failure of that coating product/process OR something was used that either wasn't compatible or used improperly OR another product was added at the time of installation


Since it seems the coating can be removed doing so would allow for the application of an aftermarket product to restore the "seal".

I realize that isn't what the customer expected when buying the tile and that they plan on changing it.




*before knowing what products were used I considered it possible that what we were seeing was actually a film left from installation


edit:*increase

 

[Mikey P]

Yes.

Maybe next time you call I'll explain...but I'll try once more.

Unglazed porcelain tile would be fine in a wet are because it has little porosity.
Any reduction in that porosity would be caused by methods to create a particular appearance (matte/polished)(Bryan's post)
When this is done sometimes a protective layer is added during manufacturing.

One wouldn't expect the protective layer to be lifted by a product that the manufacturer actually recommends and is commonly used to remove the grout haze after installation.

So if it is* the coating being removed it is a failure of that coating product/process OR something was used that either wasn't compatible or used improperly OR another product was added at the time of installation


Since it seems the coating can be removed doing so would allow for the application of an aftermarket product to restore the "seal".

I realize that isn't what the customer expected when buying the tile and that they plan on changing it.




*before knowing what products were used I considered it possible that what we were seeing was actually a film left from installation

The manufacturers can say what ever the F they want about the non porosity of unglazed porcelain.

This lady was sold/promised that her new unglazed floor would clean up with ease...

There is nothing easy about cleaning this crap, even for a truckmount equipped pro with a spinner at 1200 and pH14 Oxy Kaboom, let alone Mrs Piftleton and her Swiffer.

I've cleaned a ton of it and I've talked to enough frustrated cleaners to know it just plains sucks' as flooring material


Your THEORY, while appreciated, is based on promised made on lies from the manufactures.


Unglazed porcelain only belongs on ceilings.

 

[FredC]

ok Mike

 

[clean image]

Looks like color seal left on the edges.

Told this story before. Had a customer 15 years ago that sued the builder and tile manufacture, because there brand new porcelain tile in the kitchen, (new home) matt finish, was impossible for them to clean. Just like Mikey pic, turboed easy. Rest of the home had the exact same tile in a polished finish, not glazed. There was no issue with that. They went to court and lost because it was determined the tile was non absorbant.

It's not the absorbency that's the problem, it the surface texture.

 

[Mikey P]

The whole floor has been colors sealed. the light area is where she used the haze remover.


At this point she has give up as water is absorbing into the tile and leave marks.


Time Yeater has been plying with some aluminum oxide finishes that can be mopped on, that dry level and look great...BUT leave the grout cloudy and or shiny.

Ripping this crap out is the answer, despite what Fred thinks.