HydraMaster CDSxDrive Overview from the Experience

[dgardner]

batteries buffer the transfer and ensure constant power.

Are you saying the x-Drive includes batteries between the generator and motor controller? I hadn't heard that. I doubt it.

 

[FB7777]

Blah blah blah

How much for the xDrive vs the old 4.8 ?

 

[dgardner]

*snicker*

 

[dealtimeman]

Are you saying the x-Drive includes batteries between the generator and motor controller? I hadn't heard that. I doubt it.

That is the way I advised them to do it, and that is the way they did it.

From now on I hope you have learned your lesson and won't doubt me again. Find someone to give you a hug.

Ps I dropped the mic!

 

[SamIam]

Oh snap again.

 

[Johnny]

Can it be plugged into the grid to relieve some or all of the load on the engine?

 

[dealtimeman]

No that would be a nightmare.

Plus for that much power you would need 220-240v anyhow.

 

[Doug Rice]

Plus for that much power you would need 220-240v anyhow.

to relieve some or all of the load

 

[Cleanworks]

No that would be a nightmare.

Plus for that much power you would need 220-240v anyhow.

Probably not but it would be nice to be able to use it as a backup generator if your power went out

 

[clean image]

My first question is if there is ability to run my stone machine that run 220/240 15-20 Amps off this? L-20 twist lock please.

I am sure 24-25 horse electric motor is 3 phase minimum

As far as fuel savings.. The efficiency loss of the generator and electric motor I would put at 20-40%. End of day it will likely be a wash

 

[dgardner]

That is the way I advised them to do it, and that is the way they did it.

From now on I hope you have learned your lesson and won't doubt me again. Find someone to give you a hug.

Ps I dropped the mic!

Lemme guess - you're the exclusive distributor for replacement batteries.

 

[dealtimeman]

As of right now, yes

 

[BIG WOOD]

You guys are looking way too deep in this truck mount. The three most important things we need to be concerned with are, will it hold the heat, can it suck, and is it reliable???

But my question was never answered. How many testers were out there and how many hours are on them?

 

[SamIam]

A lot bro, trust me a whole lot.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Blah blah blah

How much for the xDrive vs the old 4.8 ?

"If you have to ask, you can't afford it."

 

[Louis]

Hopefully it is a good dc motor. They have more torque and last long time. If that generator or motor goes out that is going to be an expensive repair. Time for the tm mechanic to back to school.

 

[rick imby]

@Matt Wood Hydramaster is after the big carpet cleaning companies with this machine. It is being demo'd by the companies that have a great relationship with Hydramaster so the upgrades and shortcomings on the initial design will not be public. They have been testing it in the field for a couple of years now.

They plan on having everything right before they release it to the public.

 

[Total_Rookie]

Thanks Hydramaster and MB for the footage.

Looks like a great unit that's addressing an industry issue for direct drives. The carbon monoxide emissions are also a huge purchase factor to us. (xDRIVE are much less than slide in's I imagine.)

The only major concern I foresee is material used for production. The aluminum on HM seems to corrode very easily.

 

[Mikey P]

Use a devastator filter..

 

[doylebloss]

Thanks for the feedback.
Here is some information from our Engineering team addressing some of the questions raised:

1. Fuel efficiency numbers. Fuel consumption is very similar to a CDS. It ranges from 1.48gph in an economy setting to 1.95 gph in the boost setting.
   
   
2. Engine rpm 1500 vs 2000. We have tested various different engine rpms. The 1500-1700 rpm range does not spin the generator fast enough to produce enough power for ‘full load’ operation, which is considered to be: 3000rpm blower speed, 1200psi pump pressure, and 14”Hg of vacuum.
   
   
3. Voltage and frequency changes from generator affecting motor performance. Both the generator and motor are controlled independently so any changes in generator voltage or frequency do not effect motor performance.
   
   
4. Motor efficiency numbers. Both the generator and motor run at 96% electrical efficiency.
   

 

[dealtimeman]

Let me say I don't particularly "like" the performance of the regular CDs.

With that said this xdrive is defiantly a step up and in the right direction. The suction was strong and didn't "bog down" under continuous vac at 14" for even minutes.

Bigger blower is much better and with the door closed and on boost the truck is relatively very quiet.

I'm telling you, if it is as reliable as the regular CDs's this thing will be a home run for hydramaster.

Also think I saw somewhere it has a 3 year warranty, don't quote me but I do think I saw that so where on their advertising.

 

[Zee]

Let me say I don't particularly "like" the performance of the regular CDs.

With that said this xdrive is defiantly a step up and in the right direction. The suction was strong and didn't "bog down" under continuous vac at 14" for even minutes.

Bigger blower is much better and with the door closed and on boost the truck is relatively very quiet.

I'm telling you, if it is as reliable as the regular CDs's this thing will be a home run for hydramaster.

Also think I saw somewhere it has a 3 year warranty, don't quote me but I do think I saw that so where on their advertising.

Defiantly better?

Well, I'd want something that wants to be better!

 

[dealtimeman]

Zee it's a rebel and can't help it.

How many do you want to order?

 

[Pioneer Floorcare]

Heat

Anyone tried mounting the blower and pump in the engine compartment? Would probably require a bulge in the hood and/or other body modification, but would be simpler mechanically and probably less expensive.

buildup during operation would overheat the blower ( have you ever felt your blower after 6 hrs of running (this could be mitigated by a liquid cooled blower)) and in cool climates you would have to consider freezing while driving

 

[rick imby]

Thanks for the feedback.
Here is some information from our Engineering team addressing some of the questions raised:

1. Fuel efficiency numbers. Fuel consumption is very similar to a CDS. It ranges from 1.48gph in an economy setting to 1.95 gph in the boost setting.
   
   
2. Engine rpm 1500 vs 2000. We have tested various different engine rpms. The 1500-1700 rpm range does not spin the generator fast enough to produce enough power for ‘full load’ operation, which is considered to be: 3000rpm blower speed, 1200psi pump pressure, and 14”Hg of vacuum.
   
   
3. Voltage and frequency changes from generator affecting motor performance. Both the generator and motor are controlled independently so any changes in generator voltage or frequency do not effect motor performance.
   
   
4. Motor efficiency numbers. Both the generator and motor run at 96% electrical efficiency.

Thanks Doyle,

A question I do have ( I'm just curious) does the electric motor run on 22o volts 3 phase 60 amps or is it 440 volts 3 phase 30 amps or is it direct current?

I guess I am really asking is what is the generator output?

I am not an electrician and don't know how those electon thingys really work.

Dan and I were wondering about the energy loss converting to electric and back to mechanical---96% each way would be 8% loss. I think Dan owes me--I was guessing 10% total and he thought 10% each way.

 

[Bob Pruitt]

This is a much better video of Hydra Master's CDs XDrive.

 

[dgardner]

Cool! I saw the fluid connections on the motor and was going to ask if it was water-cooled, but then it was explained that both the motor and generator are.

So after seeing the video I'm guessing a DC generator and a PMAC motor with controller.

 

[rick imby]

Cool! I saw the fluid connections on the motor and was going to ask if it was water-cooled, but then it was explained that both the motor and generator are.

So after seeing the video I'm guessing a DC generator and a PMAC motor with controller.

DC you say---I have no idea what a PMAC is---

Looks like Hydramaster worked hard to keep as many of the same components as possible from their current direct drive systems...

 

[dgardner]

Permanent Magnet AC. Here's an example of a water-cooled PMAC all packaged up with controller and cooling system:

http://www.electricmotorsport.com/e...id-cooled-motor-drive-system-72-84v-550a.html

And here's a whitepaper that discusses the technology (PMAC's start on page 6):

http://www.leeson.com/documents/PMAC_Whitepaper.pdf

I have been using regular AC induction motors and dabbled in DC motors for years, but have only read about PMAC's, never actually used one.

 

[Cleanworks]

Thanks Hydramaster and MB for the footage.

Looks like a great unit that's addressing an industry issue for direct drives. The carbon monoxide emissions are also a huge purchase factor to us. (xDRIVE are much less than slide in's I imagine.)

The only major concern I foresee is material used for production. The aluminum on HM seems to corrode very easily.

Aluminum corrodes very slowly. The aluminum frame and tanks will outlast the vehicle they are installed in.